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Mel

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Midway
Sungila
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Mel Empty Mel

Post by Sungila Sat Aug 08, 2015 1:52 am

There was a minor incident in Teamspeak tonight which may have played into Maxie's post about needing to take a break from the game for a while.  I'll be honest and admit that I was on-and-off my computer and was only half paying attention to Teamspeak anyway, so Midway and Mutt may need to help adjust my recollection of events.  Mel and Maxie and some other folks were doing some stuff in game.  They decided to PvP so she could still play with Maxie even if he wanted to try Revenant.  Something happened there, where Mel had to suddenly cancel a match or something (again, not quite clear on what it was), then Maxie left suddenly saying he had some other stuff to do, and logged.  I noticed this was unusual for him; normally he sticks around for a bit, and him and Mel seemed to be getting along well, especially as he's generally willing to play with her and interact with her on Teamspeak.  (To be honest, he's seemed to be far more patient with her than I have.)

At the same time that this happened, Midway and I were talking in PMs in-game, and he let me know that there have been a number of complaints from other members about Mel.  I asked Midway to pull myself and Mutt into the officers channel in TS for a brief discussion, and volunteered to pull Mel aside later tonight after further consultation with others.  I asked them to give me more specifics on the types of complaints, as it helps to give specifics when giving feedback.  (Let's face it, "You're annoying; fix it" is a personal attack and doesn't give the other person a direction in which to go!)

At the same time that I was talking to Midway and Mutt, Mell started to message me in game, so it kind of turned into an in-the-moment situation.  I went ahead and talked to her about what her concern was.  She was feeling anxious and depressed over Maxie's abrupt departure from TS (at this point he hadn't posted about taking a break, I didn't see that until I was talking to Kara after my conversation with Mel).  I hopped into a TS channel with her and we talked back and forth.  For a lot of reasons she was having difficulty responding verbally so she typed back at me a lot.  Some of what we discussed was incredibly personal and I don't want to air her private information here, but I did take the opportunity to address a few things with her.

We talked about a number of things, and I did give her some feedback about the way that she interacts with other folks in the guild.  I tried to help her gain some perspective on how that might affect how others respond to her.  To some degree she is picking up on some of this stuff and seeing it herself.  However, she personalizes things to a great degree.  If others don't agree with her opinion, she takes that as a personal attack and feels like whoever's disagreeing is making her feel stupid and small. There's definitely some social interaction issues going on with her, and there's some personal stuff (again don't feel comfortable getting into specifics) that may get in the way of fixing that right away.  Her attitude was "I'm bad with people and I can't help that." I gave her specific examples, such as her frustration with "I guess no one wants to PvP with me then!" as well as the way she was treating mordredjack the other day ("I'm done with the newb.  Can someone else take over newb duty?").  Her frustration tolerance is very low, leading to the abrasiveness, and she seems to feel any type of rejection keenly.  While I talked to her, she seemed to be resistant to some of the feedback, and doesn't really believe herself capable of changing at this moment.  I don't know how much of this is again that personal stuff getting in the way, or how much was just how she was feeling at that moment (feedback can be hard to take).

When I explained to her that I'd have to share some of this with the other officers, she did not take it well.  (I'll admit I should've been more upfront about that at the beginning of the conversation.)  She got very passive aggressive at that point saying that she didn't know I was an officer and she didn't want me telling anyone what she'd told me.  We did discuss personal responsibility some (she says she's "bad with forums" but we've encouraged her to register here numerous times since she's been in the guild, and the explanations of the ranks are posted on here, not to mention have been discussed in TS many many times; ignorance of the law is no excuse, though I didn't put it that bluntly), as we can be forgiving of stuff like that but only up to a point.  She was afraid I'd suddenly tell everyone, and struggled to hear me when I said that the officer stuff was private but also necessary as I have to address the things that affect the guild as a whole.  She's also afraid of being kicked from the guild.  Again there was a lot of personalizing of the interaction (on the "you're telling me this to make me feel bad" level) going on.  I reassured her as often as I could that we don't like kicking people, we try to have these conversations early on so we can intervene and fix things long before they get to that point,and that we are willing to work with her if she's willing to try.  She asked if we were expecting her personality to change, and I clarified again and again that it's not so much that as much as behavior (which is something folks have control over) but right now she's identifying with her behavior and not feeling like she is capable of controlling it.  Again, don't know how much of that is due to other factors.  By the end there also seemed to be some attempt to guilt-trip me into letting up--I think she was looking strictly for absolution, for the reassurance that everything was okay and that she hadn't done anything wrong, which wasn't something I could give her as that's unrealistic.

Normally I'd have waited for further discussion before jumping in, but as she started messaging me with some of this stuff indicating that she was noticing how people treated her, it kind of forced my hand.  I do have screenshots, but I'll have to censor them as some of the stuff discussed was highly upsetting and highly personal (and I think that's what increased her anxiety about me being an officer when she realized, as she assumed by default that I'd air all her dirty laundry with the entire guild).  After that I talked with Kara, which is when we found out about Maxie's post on the forums.  I don't know what specifically prompted his sudden departure from TS, or his break from the game, but it was unusual behavior for him, and I couldn't help but wonder if earlier incidents with Mel with her tonight had contributed to his decision--either because of how she responded to him, or how others responded to her (I've noticed he does occasionally white-knight for her a bit).

Mel did log off TS and game a bit after that, but after she took a break she did return and did message me on TS.  I'm not sure if that means that things between us are "fixed" right now, but at least she seems willing to continue the conversation.  I've told her that, like any guildie, if she's got stuff going on in her personal life that she needs to vent about, she can come to me (or Kara--at Kara's suggestion) if she needs someone to listen or vent to.  I again clarified with her that personal stuff is kept personal, but that we'll discuss with other officers if it's going to affect other guildies or the guild as a whole (e.g. if one guildie's behavior is bothering others or somesuch).  The sense I'm getting is that she's a kid, she's feeling a bit lost, and she's got some personal shit going on, so this may be a long road.

I'm open to feedback on this, if there's anything I could have done differently or if anyone has ideas to try that might help her out.  I'll also keep an ear to the ground over the next few weeks to see if it seems she took any of that feedback to heart.

Sungila
Level 9

Guild : Army of Lightness
Number of posts : 95
City : Orlando
Occupation : Social Worker/Therapist
Registration date : 2015-07-04

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

Post by Midway Sat Aug 08, 2015 2:39 am

Kara is aware of this, but i'll let it be known for the record. At the time of this going on Mutt, myself, and Sung were the only officers/junior officers online at the moment. (Seamon was online but was unreachable at the time) I was getting complaints and questions about Mel throughout the day. I was in whispers with Mutt and Sung discussing Mel and the list of complaints/questions that had arisen throughout the day. (I admit i should've taken better notes.)

Sung did volunteer to speak with Mel. She wanted to give Mel a fair shot at a second chance. Since we did just go through something similar with Nytri. I agreed to let Sung speak with Mel only if Mutt would second it. I understand that Sung is a junior officer and this is really not something they're suppose to do. But I figure a cool calm head and maybe a fellow female would be easier to talk to then Mutt or myself.

We did act fast on this with little discussion but we had felt it had gotten to the point of needing to be addressed immediately.

I understand this did not follow procedure. But I feel that we acted in the best intentions within the current situation. If anyone feels as though we acted out of line, please hold me responsible for any outcome. Sung stepped up and volunteered and Mutt backed me on the decisions. But i'm the one that brought it to them.

I've been pushing that officers should have the balls to take care of discipline in guild. I believe i may have dropped the ball on this one. And i apologize.
Midway
Midway
Level 40

Guild : Army of Lightness
Number of posts : 404
Registration date : 2014-06-09

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

Post by The Beau Brothers Sat Aug 08, 2015 2:57 am

I had been collecting complaints from several people.  I was holding off a bit for more information.  But, officers do have the authority to handle situations like this.  Other people you may wish to speak to are Shahar (Xarion) and Zantaric.  Maybe, see if you can PM Michael on the forum.  I sent him a message already.  I'll leave this in your hands now.  If she or anyone else wishes to talk to me or intervene, let me know.
The Beau Brothers
The Beau Brothers
Divine Light

Male
Guild : AOL
Number of posts : 2949
City : Morgan City, LA
Occupation : Student, Math Tutor
Hobbies : Gaming, Cooking, Bowling, Entertaining Friends
Registration date : 2007-09-19

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

Post by Sungila Sat Aug 08, 2015 7:21 pm

Well, it seems she's trying. Was with Mel in TS today. She's giving it a shot--asking politely for help in guild chat (and in TS after), and reining in frustration when there were few responses or not the kind of responses she wanted. She also respectfully suggested that a dungeon group use the dungeon channels for a CoE run (and I can't argue with that--we should be using the dungeon channels for what they were intended for), but it wasn't because the dungeon chat would annoy her. It was, in her words, "So I won't be disruptive to you."

So there's still stuff to work on, sure, but she's giving it a shot. Smile

I did get in touch with Maxie via Facebook, just asking if everything was all right. He didn't say much other than he's trying to avoid drama and arguing for the moment.

Sungila
Level 9

Guild : Army of Lightness
Number of posts : 95
City : Orlando
Occupation : Social Worker/Therapist
Registration date : 2015-07-04

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

Post by seamonster Sat Aug 08, 2015 8:12 pm

Seems like you all took the right path to this situations.  hopefully she can find a happy medium.  I was on but had my headphones off watching the points of interest at the time so I didn't hear what was going on.
seamonster
seamonster
Level 21

Male
Guild : AoL
Number of posts : 218
Registration date : 2010-01-28

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

Post by Dragnix Pheodron Sat Aug 08, 2015 9:00 pm

I have spoken to everyone involved in this instance and I am aware of what is happening.
I have also spoken with Mel, she openly discussed some of her 'issues' and I have given her a few short term 'fixes' of which we can see if she handles it.
I am glad she suggested about the dungeon channel as that was one of the things that I encouraged her to speak up about so she doesnt feel like she is interrupting people.
I will wait and see how this goes for awhile and I will continue taking notes.
I would appreciate it if everyone could back off a little and just observe and take notes for me.
If you notice anything unacceptable I would like it noted in here or taken directly to me please.
This is quite important as I do NOT want many people complicating the issue by getting involved!
Dragnix Pheodron
Dragnix Pheodron
Level 50

Female
Guild : Army of Lightness (AoL)
Number of posts : 522
City : Melbourne, Australia
Occupation : Student
Registration date : 2014-06-08

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

Post by Mrs Tech Sat Aug 08, 2015 9:42 pm

Looks like it was handle very well, sorry if I wasn't around much today as I was up late and was probably asleep. doesn't happen very often and normally I would have been available, once again sorry for not being available when needed. flower flower
Mrs Tech
Mrs Tech
Level 17

Female
Guild : AOL
Number of posts : 179
City : Coventry UK
Occupation : Avon Rep :P
Hobbies : GW's FB, Knitting,Darts,
Registration date : 2014-04-06

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Mel Empty Re: Mel

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